Book Three Chapters 4-6: Threats
"...They threaten you with something-something you can't stand up to. And then you say, 'Don't do it to me, do it to somebody else.' And perhaps you might pretend afterwards, what it was only a trick and that you just said it to make them stop and didn't really mean it. But that isn't true. At the time when it happens you do mean it. You think there's no other way of saving yourself...you want it to happen to the other person. You don't give a damn what they suffer. All you care about is yourself." (240)
In the scene where O'Brien is torturing Winston and even goes as far as almost letting rats eat Winston's face, O'Brien knows that Winston fears rats and that this ideas of rats eating his face would surely break him. O'Brien is right because Winston tells O'Brien to do this to Julia and not him. Later on, Julia confesses to Winston that when she was in a similar situation she betrayed Winston as well. Maybe if Winston and Julia truly loved each other, they would not have said betrayed each other because love means that they would do anything for each other sometimes people would even die for their loved one. In this scene Julia tells Winston that although she did not believe she actually meant what she said about having the torture inflicted on him, she now realizes she did mean it because she wanted to save herself. It is in these moments when people realize how far they are willing to go for the person they love and in this case, Winston and Julia are not willing to die for one another. Afterwards both Julia and Winston acknowledge that they do not feel the same way for each other after that incident because both of them realized that the possibility that their attraction must have simply been physical and for the fact that they could help each other in the rebellion, however, now they do not need each other and they do not want to endure the torture again.
In the scene where O'Brien is torturing Winston and even goes as far as almost letting rats eat Winston's face, O'Brien knows that Winston fears rats and that this ideas of rats eating his face would surely break him. O'Brien is right because Winston tells O'Brien to do this to Julia and not him. Later on, Julia confesses to Winston that when she was in a similar situation she betrayed Winston as well. Maybe if Winston and Julia truly loved each other, they would not have said betrayed each other because love means that they would do anything for each other sometimes people would even die for their loved one. In this scene Julia tells Winston that although she did not believe she actually meant what she said about having the torture inflicted on him, she now realizes she did mean it because she wanted to save herself. It is in these moments when people realize how far they are willing to go for the person they love and in this case, Winston and Julia are not willing to die for one another. Afterwards both Julia and Winston acknowledge that they do not feel the same way for each other after that incident because both of them realized that the possibility that their attraction must have simply been physical and for the fact that they could help each other in the rebellion, however, now they do not need each other and they do not want to endure the torture again.
So I really really really like the points you are making here because it brings up some stuff that I have been thinking for awhile about Winston and Julia. You mention that perhaps if they truly loved each other, they wouldn't have betrayed each other, and while I don't think this is necessarily true, it does show just how much they don't love each other.
ReplyDeleteIf you consider it, Winston used to completely hate Julia, and he only really changes his mind after she gives him the note that read "I love you". Besides, she delivers that note despite never even properly speaking to Winston. The whole thing just seems incredibly flaky, so their "love" never really felt genuine. Instead, it was like they both needed some sort of outlet against the Party. They decided to love each other because it allowed them to just basically blow off some steam, and pretend for awhile that they were away from their (grim) realities. Even describing their little get away in the middle of the woods a "political act" seems fake. Don't get me wrong, I completely see how it can be taken as a great big middle finger to the Party, but it just seems like they are making excuses; by labeling their act a true rebellion, they are insisting their love is real.
When they met up and agreed that they simply could not feel the same way about each other after enduring torture and giving each other up, it seems a whole lot like they are just finally admitting to each other that it was fake. I think that was their way of accepting that their "rebellion" (read: their relationship) was impossible (read: obviously failed because the feelings weren't there).
Hai, I like the quote you chose because it shows that both of them just wanted to save their own life. In your analysis, you mentioned that it was possible that they were attracted to each other just because because they were both against the party, and that would make sense since Winston thought of physically harming her at first. Also, when Julia gave him the note, saying she loves him, that was really weird because they did not talk to each other at that time. I agree that they realized that they did not need each other because they do not want to experience being tortured again.
ReplyDeleteI agree with you 100%. No one who truly loves someone wants to be the source of their pain. I personally believe that I would choose my loved ones over myself so this was the nail in the coffin that confirmed that Julia and Winston didn't feel much for one another. Their whole relationship was built around sex and rebellion and anyone that is even remotely attracted to people know that that is not a very strong or healthy foundation for a relationship. Sex with no emotions can be tricky especially in the situation and environment that Julia and Winston live in. Throwing rebellion into the mix doesn't make anything easy because with rebellion comes failure, death, and betrayal.
ReplyDeleteI agree with this quote how one who loves each other would never tell one another to choose that person. I don't think it was true love because if it was they would have to put up with the consequences they caused. I say what they had closest with each other was rebelling against the party. But when one rebels theres torture, so Im pretty sure they would not do it again if they would rat each other out.
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